zane: spoken word

Zane Scarborough from Attitude was with us last week sharing some of his spoken word poetry. We were all pretty inspired by this guy and his encouragement to express ourselves in new ways. I found Dietrich's poem the most moving, "Which hill will you die on?" Good stuff.

Have a listen!

coming out about doubt

Well, I sure wasn't ready for that.

Last Monday I decided to write a post trying to put words to how I felt about some of my experiences with church. I really went for it. I think it's fair to say that I was a bit angry about the way I felt managed, kept in line and essentially controlled in the past. I felt like the church at times had been my thought police who had stepped in when I failed their orthodoxy test. I guess what I was trying to get across was that I feel there are more important things to church life then holding up values or doctrines. Not that they're not important.

But what a reaction! In 24 hours the post had been read 400 times, had been shared all over New Zealand, Australia and the UK and had been met with quite a reaction. Many people felt understood by the fact I was acknowledging these struggles, and many seemed to feel exactly what I did. People actually thanked me for writing it. Personally, it felt like a huge relief to know there were so many others who understood. Sometimes it feels like I'm a bit of a lone wolf. Anyone else relate?

Others got on the defensive and completely disagreed. Some felt I was undermining the Bible and the teaching of Jesus and promoting something contrary to scripture. Some felt I was promoting an empty ecclesiology, nothing more than an intellectual focus group while I was neglecting other important jobs of what the church should be doing, like walking in the Spirit, evangelism and caring for communities.

Whether you agree with the post or not, it seems that it hit a nerve. Whether you agree with it or not, the fact that there are so many people who feel like that means that you cannot just dismiss this way of thinking, you have to engage with it. And it isn't just me and my friends. The studies are saying that these tensions are causing young adults to walk away from church in huge numbers.

A few notes on what I wrote. It was not a treatise on ecclesiology. It was an expression of frustration in ecclesiology not implictly making room for these concerns. Sure, not everyone cares about the way the biblical canon was decided, not everyone cares about the complexities of interpretation and not everyone cares about what we mean when we use certain words. So of course the blog post didn't resonate with everyone. And that's great for them, because churches tend to give them exactly what they want in Sunday teaching, in small group discussions and doctrine: neatly packaged faith statements and application points. We all know people who just like to be told what to believe about something, and that really is fine. The point is, if we run church like this all the time, we are implicitly saying to those who do think about this stuff that their concerns don't matter as much. We confine it to one-on-one conversations with people who quite often haven't thought about it to the same extent and usually don't know how deep the rabbit hole goes with some stuff, causing even more frustration.

Similarly, there are some that go to church primarily to experience God, maybe in a worship time, to hear from Him and feel His presence, and so these issues are maybe side issues for them. But what about those who don't engage with God like this? What if someone is struggling with questions of spiritual experience, hype, musical emotional manipulation and criteria that we use to deem whether or not the Spirit is present? We implicitly tell them that the show must go on. How can we make room for this important stuff?

The other thing to bear in mind, is that this is just a blog. A conversation starter. And I'm learning lots about how things can be interpreted once they're in a public forum. Try and hear the spirit of what I'm saying if you can!

Many messages are picked up in the way we do church, the fact that we use stages, the way we structure our services, the amount of time allocated to different activities, and the conversations we allow to take part on a Sunday. All these things say something about what we really believe.

But what do I think? Well the things is, I don't really know yet! But I'm excited to be part of a community that is open to trying new things, to rethinking preaching, worship, belonging and doing community together. To be flexible and not too prescriptive with Sunday church. Essentially, I'm thinking along the lines of listening to the concerns of the people you have first, before storming ahead with a vision statement. Turning up in a new community with a framework already worked out could be pretty silly. However, I will think about this over the next little while and try to flesh out my thoughts, and we will also be running a discussion night next month on some new ideas, so stay tuned for that.

New thinking around preaching and worship can be difficult when there is a strong theology around apostleship, the word of God and anointing of the people of God. This is particularly where theology becomes significant for church life.

Other questions were raised about my use of scripture, what does the bible say about doubt? Does Jesus endorse it like I seem to? He doesn't seem to discourage it, and doubt certainly isn't the antithesis to faith - maybe certainty is. But that's another huge discussion.

In closing, I'm beginning to see my role a bit more clearly. I'm in a unique position - I am a young adult in New Zealand who feels what many of my peers feel about the church that cause them to walk away from it. Yet I work for a church, in young adults ministry. A church that I love and believe in and feel trusted by. So maybe a big part of my job is to give air time to these concerns, to make them heard, to try and make people sit up and listen to them. To show that the church cares about this stuff and is working hard to address it in all areas of church life. Part of this will be having people tell their stories on this blog. If this sounds like something you would like to do, you can email me.

Change might hurt a bit, but I'm hopeful. Let's keep the conversation alive!

song of songs

Sunday was one of the most interesting church services I've ever been in. No one ever talks about the Song of Songs and I guess it is understandable when you hear it talked about like this. Yael was really frank and highlighted some important reflections on the text. We all turned into giggling tweens again, but perhaps if you listen you will understand why.

It is important to note that there were quite a few people that weren't happy with some of the ideas. People struggled, and some were even offended by the way it was presented. Not everyone agreed. You're not asked to. But there were also a lot of people who felt liberated by this. You decide. Think critically with an open mind!

doubt.

I have been around Christian institutions my whole life. I have worked in them for years. I've attended Christian schools and taught at them. I've been in thousands of church services and run some myself. During my time within them I have changed immensely and my thinking has developed as I have struggled to think with the story of the Bible. The way I see and engage with God has changed and broadened, the way I understand the purpose of the church has been wrestled with and the way I view and use the Bible has been a big issue for me at times.

What has been frustrating is that at many points in my journey I have been made to feel that some of the thoughts around these issues are 'off track' or not faithful to the faith convictions I should adhere to if I want to say that I'm a Christian. I have been told that I think too much. I have been accused of fearing man rather than God. I have been told that my problem is that I read too many books about the Bible, rather than the Bible itself. I have been told that my thinking is at the top of a slippery slope into relativism. I have been told that my desire to think deeply about faith is a phase, a period of deconstruction.

To be honest, on one level this is just patronising and naively self-assured. On another level it is really just completely ignorant of the complex issues of faith. However, now that I have thought about these issues and really done my research, I am now more passionate about Jesus than ever before. Because I have gone through periods of being really unsettled I have delved into ideas with intention. Yes, at times it wasn't easy. But so what? Sure, some won't arrive at the 'correct' conclusion, but the statistics are showing us that this disconnection with church is happening anyway.

Through all the research I have read recently on why young people are leaving the church, my personal frustrations with my own experiences have increasingly felt more validated. I am not alone in this. The feelings of alienation and long periods of trying to live with these tensions are extremely common. In a lot of cases, people leave church because it is an environment in which doubt is stamped out. Where theology is static and shallow and kept within the bounds of what is thought to be orthodox.

This is an ecclesiology of fear.

Some Christian institutions seem to be afraid of honest inquiry. They seem to be afraid that if you allow yourself to think for long enough, you will no longer reach the same conclusions as they have. They seem to be afraid that if people are exposed to ways of thinking different to their own then they will be destabilised. But why be afraid of that? What is the fear really about? Losing control? Losing loyalty? Diversity of opinion and having leadership challenged? The authority of preaching being questioned?

What if we let go? What if we have to engage in robust discussion rather than relying on the (corporate?) structures of heirarchy?

You cannot practise dependance if you are decieved with the illusion of certainty.

Is doubt a crucial part of faith? How does this relationship work?

One thing is for sure, I am not prepared to accept simple answers if they don't present me with the truth.

The prospect of being part of a faith community that actively embraces doubt excites me. It is freeing. It allows people to let their guard down and be honest with the things they haven't figured out, yet not feel on the outer. But how does a church do this?

Listen to the people that doubt. Which really, is most people. If you have young adults (or anyone for that matter) who are wrestling with questions of how we know, the authority of the bible, ecclesiology and worldview, then acknowledge it! Talking about the 3 steps to building your faith, or regurgitating sermons about depending on God in a strictly personal sense aren't going to mean much to these people. For some communities, maybe sermons need to be something that requires intellectual rigour. Maybe people need more than just motivation and a sense of inner peace. Maybe we need to work for our understanding. Maybe we have to learn to embrace the tension of not knowing while we seek to understand.

It doesn't sound so bad to me.

A few weeks ago at church my good friend Hugh shared his thoughts about his own struggles with doubt. I thought it was brilliant. We need to hear more stuff like this. Check it here:



The quote he used by Madeleine L'Engle is fantastic:

"Those who believe they believe in God but without passion in the heart, without anguish of mind, without uncertainty, without doubt, and even at times without despair, believe only in the idea of God, and not in God himself."

revival in new zealand?

Recently, my Facebook newsfeed has been filling up with excited discussion about a TVNZ news segment reporting that some sort of revival is going on in New Zealand. The report suggests that the numbers are heavily in favour of people having an interest in religion. You can find the video here.

Obviously, having only really heard bad news from all other research in the same field I was really interested in what was going on. University aged young adults keen on God? Sounds great! I hate to be the ever present party pooper, but it seems that this is a bit too much hype over some less than encouraging stats. Let's have a closer look at this video.

We are told that there is evidence of some sort of religious revival (Christians, bear in mind this does not necessarily mean other Christians) and then we are shown clips from Easter Camp (which looked awesome by the way). Blue is interviewed commenting that people want purpose and meaning and that might be why people still find the need for religion. We then hear about the study itself: 150 university students are surveyed and about half remain involved in religion, with 20% saying they are more devout than their parents. I can’t find the study anywhere on the internet so I’m going to have to go just from this video.

I’m involved in young adults ministry (roughly speaking 18 – 30 year olds) and to me this just seems like the same discouraging statistics dressed up in sensationalist language. How can you possibly receive a 50% church dropout by university as a good sign? This simply means that of the people that were already religious through youth groups, only half of them remain religious through university. University age generally represents only the first 3 years of the young adult years. And 50% have already dropped out of church? All other studies would say this is fairly typical, with more dropout occurring before the age of 30. I’m interested in more than just the university years, and so although it’s great that half do stick around, is it really grounds for declaring a revival?

Let’s not forget what is said at the end of the video – if people aren’t brought up with a religion they are very unlikely not to ever find it. And in the last NZ census it showed that more people identified as having no religious affiliation. It seems that you are only likely to find God if he is part of your childhood. This, at least to me, is really concerning.

Remember, this is one study amongst many, one with a small sample, and one that doesn’t seem to be as encouraging as it is made out to be. I would maybe even go further and suggest that the only reason they put this together at Easter was to get people sharing the video and generating more traffic for their site.

If people are receiving this as good news can I please suggest we raise our standards? In my view, revival means people from all walks of life turning to God and a nation being affected. I don’t see how that looks anything like losing half of our young people at university.

song of songs: 15th April

We're hugely priveleged to have Yael Klangwisan coming to speak to us on April 15th. Yael is a biblical scholar who is completing her PhD on the Song of Songs and has come incredible insights into this rarely discussed book.

Yael has sat with this text, smelled the smells, tasted the foods and relfected on the imagery in order to understand the text on its own terms. She knows (and teaches) Hebrew and so the way she is able to unpack the way in which it is written and what that says is really interesting. It celebrates sexuality, champions the cause of the woman and has a lot to say to us in the 21st century.

Come along and have your eyes opened!

5pm
April 15th
Windsor Park Baptist (Kauri Room)

the dropout problem: feedback from you guys!

Firstly, a big thank you to all those that came along to be a part of the night! We had a great night a couple of weeks back discussing ‘the dropout problem’ – why young adults are leaving the church. I presented the research and stats, along with the different types of dropouts, some of the major criticisms of those that leave the church and the culture shifts that have had a major part to play in this.


This conversation was between people from a wide range of churches, not just ours. The idea wasn’t to church bash, but to get people up to speed with what is happening around the world, and then to get some ideas. If there is a problem, we want to address it, and we need to address it for our context with our people’s concerns at heart. So here are some of the suggestions I complied from the feedback I received afterwards:

Mentoring

A major thread that was coming through was good mentoring. It seems that for young people, there tends to be a model of appointing leaders for youth and young adult work where they are put in a group and then begin implementing the program. The problem is, is that a lot of the time the program doesn’t actually address the concerns of those in the groups. They said that sometimes they are left feeling like they have to agree with it or face some sort of alienation or feel under pressure to agree with the 'proper' answers. Is this a fair evaluation?

The idea was that young people would like mentoring on a more relational level, to have someone really engage with them and the ideas they’re thinking about, rather than just working through a program. Obviously, this is a difficult one to implement at our church, when we lack people in their 30s and those who are in that age bracket are busy with jobs and families. But is there a way to use the structures already in place to lean more towards this idea?

Differentiation at the Upper end of High School

Some of the feedback from those that have just left high school is that they need more responsibility from 6^th and 7^th form in their groups – like leading discussions and putting it together themselves. Some of the feedback suggested that it becomes difficult for a youth leader to stay as passionate as needed for the whole 5 year stretch and this needs to be looked at. Further questions were raised about the way in which youth leaders are chosen and trained for youth work within the church and the criteria that is used for this. These questions were raised by was youth leaders and those who have been through the youth program. How do we really prepare young people before they leave school?

Honesty and Transparency

Picked up particularly in the written feedback was the idea that leaders need to be more open with their own doubting and personal struggles as to not give off the impression that there is a stage when you ‘make it’ as a Christian. Leaders could be more open about failure. There needs to be room to doubt and seriously question ideas and the church shouldn’t be afraid of scepticism. It was also suggested that part of the problem in church is that often Jesus is depicted as some sort of moral standard to meet, rather than the ultimate human that has done it for us. What could leadership look like as we embrace our weak humanity more as a church? Is it okay to do this?

Church Services

This stuff is the hardest because it will be very difficult to implement change across the board. People said they would like more of a mix of ages (we need you oldies at 5pm!) and would like more opportunities to engage in church wide activities. We do this already but is there a way to do it more on Sundays? Some said they would like less emotionalism in services and more robust discussion around ideas. This is heavily linked with our ideas about the function of preaching and God’s word – what are we prepared to do on Sundays with the message? Others suggested that sermons should pose open ended questions and then some material to research ourselves. Others even suggested that meetings should be less grouped around age, and more about learning styles. Really interesting ideas!

Lots have highlighted the importance of eating together. How do we do more of this as a church?

Small Groups

Finally, people would like room for some decent wrestling (not physical of course… well I guess you could…) in small groups in the week, moving from programs and personal concerns to also including good discussion, and room to disagree with the material. It seemed that the people present really wanted to delve into the Bible and work with it, rather than jumping straight into ‘simple truths’. Some suggested we could mix up the ages more too.


As a leadership team, we take these opinions seriously and want to address these issues head on. These are not issues that need to be tackled by one 'ministry area' in particular, but as was stated on the night, all the issues are pertinent for every age group.


So what do we think? Do we agree with this stuff? How can Windsor take these concerns seriously? If I have missed anything important, please leave suggestions in the comments below. If you have some good ideas, please leave it down there too. We have a lot to think about as a church but it is an exciting time that we can really give this stuff some thought. Ideas are really appreciated!

Also, stay tuned for part two of these evenings, where we can really have a good look at some interesting and more specific ideas!